There were many other minority groups who were persecuted and systematically killed in the holocaust (gypsies gays etc) but none of these groups were granted their own state. It is always wrong to collectively compensate a whole race/group of people for past injustices. The Jews should be no exception. It should be remembered that not all Jews suffered from the holocaust, only the ones in Europe did. The holocaust alone is not a legitamate reason to create the state of Israel. Likewise, not all blacks were slaves. The blacks living in the north enjoyed much better treatment than the blacks in the south, and the blacks in Africa never even suffered at all! Yet they are all entitled to the full benefits of affirmative action. Just about every minority has suffered discrimination in America but none recieves the lavish privilege that black Americans receive today.
The fact is there was already a strong push to create the Jewish state of Israel long before the holocaust. After world war 1 the British made the Balfour Declaration (1917), this was long before the holocaust.The Balfour Declaration called for a Jewish homeland in what is today Israel as a reward to the Jewish community living in pre-state Israel for providing troops and other support to Britain and the allied powers in world war 1(among other reasons), and at the same time to punish the Arabs (Ottoman Empire) for supporting the Axis powers. The Balfour Declaration was adopted by the League of Nations and many other governing bodies. At least 15 years before the holocaust even began, the Jewish state of Israel was already being created. Then again in world war 2, the Jews in current day Israel took the allies side and the Arab/Muslim world took axis side. For two major wars in a row the Jews in pre-state Israel were on the winning side, and the Arab/Muslim world was on the losing side. Following World war 2, Germany lost control of much of their land, and Japan got hit with 2 nuclear bombs for being on the wrong side of the war, and U.S.A., Britain, France, and the Soviet Union gained control of German land for being on the right side of the war. When an entity loses a war, or backs the wrong side of a war, they should be prepared to lose something. If an entity wins a war or backs the winning side, it is only fair they gain something. Thats why it was fair for the Jews to be given the state of Israel, and to revoke any potential Arab/Muslim claim to the land.
The holocaust only strengthen world opinion for this state to exist. Had the holocaust not happened many historians believe that the state of Israel still would have been created sooner or later. This is completely contrary to the situation with African Americans. The only reason why blacks have affirmative action today is to collectively compensate the whole race for past injustices. Whereas the Jews EARNED the state of Israel.
Some argue Israel is similar to affirmative action since it "discriminates" against people for citizenship based on their religion the same way white people are automatically discriminated against for college admission just because of their skin color. However its not the same the same thing. While Israel is considered a "Jewish state", any individual, of any religion, can obtain Israeli citizenship. Between 20-25% of Israel is non-Jewish. It might be easier for a Jew to obtain Israeli citizenship, since Israel has a law of return for Jewish people, but a non-Jew can become an Israeli citizen by fullfiling Israel's citizenship requirements. With affirmative action people who are not black (or of certain other minority backgrounds) are automatically ineligible for any of the benefits.
Some go as far as to compare our more than $2.5 billion annual aid to Israel to the billions of dollars we waste on affirmative action programs. This argument is flawed, however, since, unlike affirmative action, our aid to Israel has nothing to do with the holocaust and everything to do with Israel promoting America's interest in the middle east. On the contrary, blacks have created many groups, such as the Nation of Islam, which actively fund and support Islamic terrorist groups who wish to harm the U.S. It is insulting to compare blacks to Israelis, since blacks are using their privilage to abuse the system (not all blacks off course), and Israelis are just using it to escape persecution and to live their own lives.
Israel has done much to promote equality between its Jewish and non-Jewish citizens, while blacks continue to push for more racist, reverse discrimination laws that they usually end up abusing.
Many Jews will claim that the creation of Israel was not because of backing the winning side of both world wars, but because they are the "chosen people" and because "god" gave it to them. As an atheist I do not recognize this argument. "God" should never be a reason to do anything, and there is no such thing as a "chosen people". Likewise, Muslims claim "historical significance" of this land, and this claim is equally illegitimate. The Jews deserve to own Israel for COMPLETELY SECULAR REASONS. Any potential Arab/Muslim claim to Israel should be revoked due to the Arab world's support for the losing sides of world war 1 and especially world war 2.
College admissions should be based completely on merit and not at all by race. Likewise the Jewish people owning Israel should not be because of the holocaust, or because of "god", but rather because the Jews have earned it by backing the winning side of both World War 1 and World War 2.
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Comment:
Before you post your view on a position via the web, you should probably dedicate a few more hours of research to the subject.
"Affirmative action is a form of reverse discrimination in which people are discriminated against by their skin color and are given free scholarships as well as a guaranteed acceptance to any public college".
I do believe that some blacks, (btw we are called black not "African American"... are whites called "Irish American" or "German American"? None of use were originally from this continent unless you are of original American Indian decent. Unless your ancestors were born here, they came across the waters on a boat just like mine did. Why are blacks the only ones being formally classified as not being from this continent...). Nonetheless, I do believe that some blacks have misused this program just as well as every other person has misused some form of federal/government aid to include our legislators. However, if we did not have racial discrimination in the first place, if we did not have black/white only drinking fountains, if we did not have blacks having to sit on the back of the bus, if we did not have white denying jobs to black based on the upon the color of their skin, then maybe, just maybe this would not be necessary. If you believe in 2007 that we live in a rose colored Willy Wonka land where everyone is treated fairly and no one sees color but sees the integrity and character of the person, then sir, you are truly misguided. This program is not intended for compensation, if that were the case, then all blacks would have no problem with educational benefits as "all" would be compensated-- just as the reservations were intended to compensate the Indians in the some form or fashion. Is all this fair? Well I have come to see that in this lifetime, nothing is fair. Was it fair that my grandmother had to sit on the back of a bus, or that her grandmother spent her entire life in the fields and fed the scraps of pigs? Was it fair during the Chicago race riots that a black pregnant woman was disemboweled by rioters? This may not be fair however, as long as we still have employers and admissions who secretly deny employment based upon the color of the skin, what exactly do you propose? As long as we have people who discriminate based upon a person's skin color and not their skill or work ethic, what do you propose? And people in Africa didn't have to suffer? Where have you been for the last several decades? Have you never heard of Apartide? Blacks have been suffering in Africa since they were first enslaved by ancient Egyptians (who were black themselves ironically)...look it up. In the south, I still get ignored visiting some stores and and still hear the "N" used to refer to blacks by whites. I guess that means everyone who is unable to get into school or a job must be able to come and live at your house. Seriously though, I am very eager to hear what your proposed solution what be.
Regards
Response:
Hello. Sorry it took so long to respond. I may not be an expert on this subject, but I can surely give you my insight and experience from a white person’s point of view. This is a topic that most whites don’t dare bring up around blacks, but since you brought it up I’ll go ahead and share my experiences.
Please don’t be offended by what I am about to say. I am going to speak honestly and frankly.My views, more or less, represent the views of the majority of whites.
I do believe that some blacks, (btw we are called black not "African American"... are whites called "Irish American" or "German American"?
I have never heard anyone complain about being called African American. I have been told my whole life that it is offensive to call people “black”.
However, if we did not have racial discrimination in the first place, if we did not have black/white only drinking fountains, if we did not have blacks having to sit on the back of the bus, if we did not have white denying jobs to black based on the upon the color of their skin, then maybe, just maybe this would not be necessary.
You correctly acknowledge that it was wrong for blacks to be discriminated against over the decades. But I ask you: why does it make it ok to reverse discriminate? Do you know how many perfectly qualified whites have been denied jobs, scholarships, or college admissions because of affirmative action? And how many less qualified blacks have been admitted?
If you believe in 2007 that we live in a rose colored Willy Wonka land where everyone is treated fairly and no one sees color but sees the integrity and character of the person, then sir, you are truly misguided.
I don’t think we have a perfect racist-free society. I do acknowledge the existence of neo-nazi skinhead groups, which hate blacks, Mexicans, and others just because they have different colored skin. These people are outcasts in our society and their views should not even be counted in this discussion. But I believe that a large portion of the anti-black racism in our society comes from the existence of affirmative action programs and from those who insist that they are necessary. I do not agree that every employer and university is out on a campaign to marginalize blacks and keep them out of the workforce. Let me tell you from experience what many whites are afraid to say: it angers us to hear blacks blame all their problems and poverty on “racism” and then claim the whole white race is racist (this belief among blacks is racist by itself.) THAT is what causes anti-black resentment. You may not agree with this, but I am a white person, I’ve been on the “white-side” I’m telling you how we feel. You may dismiss this or try to learn from it.
Well I have come to see that in this lifetime, nothing is fair. Was it fair that my grandmother had to sit on the back of a bus, or that her grandmother spent her entire life in the fields and fed the scraps of pigs? Was it fair during the Chicago race riots that a black pregnant woman was disemboweled by rioters?
Another thing I want to bring up with you: EVERY OTHER MINORITY GROUP (INCLUDING CERTAIN WHITES) HAVE SUFFERED DISCRIMINATION IN THIS COUNTRY. Every group from Hispanics to Jews, to Asians, and even white Americans such as the Irish, the Germans, the French, and Russians have suffered discrimination. All of them have overcome it without any affirmative-action type handouts. Why is it that only blacks need these special privileges? Why is it that, despite these programs, the blacks remain on the bottom of our socio-economic latter? One example: Mexicans came to this country with nothing. But through hard work and determination they are quickly becoming the most successful minority group in this country. My last few bosses were Hispanic. Look at how many Hispanic managers we have. Yes, it is true that Hispanics receive benefits from affirmative action, but why have they managed to become much more successful much faster than the blacks have. They are a different-skinned minority too. The blacks that have TRIED have made it. Barak Obama as just one example. I have had many black doctors and have dealt with many blacks with respectable occupations. These blacks have TRIED. They didn’t just blame all their problems on “discrimination” like many in the black community do today.
This may not be fair however, as long as we still have employers and admissions who secretly deny employment based upon the color of the skin, what exactly do you propose? As long as we have people who discriminate based upon a person's skin color and not their skill or work ethic, what do you propose?
How do you know that all employers and admissioners secretly discriminate? In fact if we had color-blind college applications, how would the admitioners know if the applicant was black or white? What we are doing is FORCING the admitioners to discriminate. I wonder how you would feel if a black employer discriminated against whites. If you truly oppose racism, why is racism against whites ok? Do you deny the existence of anti-white racists among the black community? By accusing all whites (or even the majority of whites) of discriminating against blacks, you are administrating a form of anti-white discrimination. Can you blame the whites for being upset about this? Can you blame the whites for resenting the black community for blaming them for the crimes of their ancestors? Crimes in which no form of re-payment is sufficient to blacks?
And people in Africa didn't have to suffer? Where have you been for the last several decades? Have you never heard of Apartide? Blacks have been suffering in Africa since they were first enslaved by ancient Egyptians (who were black themselves ironically)...look it up. In the south.
What I meant was the blacks in Africa didn’t suffer at all BY OUR ACTIONS. My point is a black from Africa, who did not suffer from American slavery or segregation, is automatically eligible for all the benefits of affirmative action. Remember, it was the whites that stopped the apartheid. In fact it was the whites that stopped slavery
I oppose racism. That’s why I oppose all forms of affirmative action. I believe blacks and whites are equal and no side should be subject to discrimination or special privileges. Both races have the right to live as equal citizens of our society. My question to you: why are you so afraid of a level playing field? Why do you (I don’t mean you personally) discriminate against whites by believing we are all out to get you and marginalize you? How do you expect us whites to live in harmony with a group that’s constantly calling us racist and demanding special privileges for themselves? You didn’t like it when whites were receiving special privileges, so why do two wrongs make a right?
Please do not feel offended by my response, I am only sharing what us white people do not dare speak of around blacks. I hope you will not dismiss what I said as “racist propaganda”. I hope you will share this with other blacks and use it to end all race-based discrimination and to promote goodwill between our two peoples. Whether you want to admit it or not these affirmative action programs are an obstacle to good black/white relations. I am very interested to hear your response as well.
Up till now Wendy has not responded...